While discussing the situation advocating bombing Iran, Dr Savage recounted Reagan’s attack on Libya as justification:
“Remember what Reagan did when he was in trouble politically – don’t ever forget it – he unleashed at the time I think it was F15s and F16s – no they were F15s off an aircraft carrier in the Gulf of Tripoli when Qaddafi was threatening the world and they fired missiles into the tent and that was the end of Qaddafi’s threats to the world”. (direct transcript from a recording on my cell phone)
Problems with Savage’s “history” lesson
– this happened in April 1986, midway through Reagan’s second term. Running for re-election was not a concern. Iran Contra was festering, but would not pick up momentum until after the Democrats won control of the Senate in December 1988. Reagan’s approval rating before the attack during 1986 was in the 60% range. Perhaps Reagan was unpopular with Savage’s 1986 era friends in San Francisco
– the planes that bombed the tent and the airfields were Air Force F111s launched from an RAF airbase in England. France (and Spain) refused the request to permit us overfly the country, which resulted in the anti-French sentiment immediately after. The NAVY planes from the 3 aircraft carriers were A6, A7 and FA/18 aircraft (and several support aircraft). The carrier based planes were mostly carrying HARM and strike anti radar missiles and radar jamming to protect the incoming Air Force bombers.
– The F15E (the strike version of the F15, which was a fighter aircraft) was not delivered to the US Air Force until 1988. F15’s are flown by the Air Force, not the Navy – they do not operate from Aircraft carriers
– The F16 is primarily an air-to-air fighter combat plane used by the Air Force, not the Navy and cannot fly off a carrier.
– there is no place called “The gulf of Tripoli” – it’s the “Gulf of Sidra”
– there were no air-to-ground “missiles” involved. The bombers dropped a combination of “dumb” MK-82 unguided bombs, and the F111s carried GBU-10 laser-guided unpowered bombs. Missiles are weapons with a propulsion system. A GBU is not a “missile” – GB means “Guided Bomb”.
– It did not neuter Qadaffi – Pan AM 103 would happen in December 1988, and Libya began development of its nuclear weapons program – which only was disclosed and stopped with the US Invasion of Iraq
If you’re getting your knowledge of history and the U.S. military tactics from Dr Savage, you need to take a deep look inside yourself and ask why. I’ve never been in the military, but spotted those errors right away (“F” generally means “Fighter”, “A” = “Attack” – although multi-purpose aircraft have blurred that line more recently)
That guest on Milt Rosenburg’s show is really proving the truth of his work – Savage thinks he knows history to the point that he demands you accept his highly inaccurate version based on faulty memory as “truth”.
[For those who want to argue and deflect the main point, I leave you the topic of the correct spelling of Qaddafi]
Art,
Although you seem very adept at research via Wikipedia, I think that you may be missing the point. Savage is not a historian and that is a fact. He is full of himself without a doubt. He makes plenty of mistakes as he is human. He tends to get himself worked into a frenzy at times and this is what probably causes his “history lessons” to be less than accurate.
I didn’t hear this particular rant and don’t know what his exact point was, but I believe that the intent was to make the point that when there is a direct threat to Americans, U.S. presidents should take the initiative to squash that threat. Our current leader has no desire to repel invaders; he is too busy trying to look good for his friends in the media and elsewhere.
Gee, I typed in the exact quote. So you are saying you don’t care about the facts and that every point of his story was factually wrong. I clearly remembered the flap at the time about the planes having to go around the Iberian peninsula and the refueling problems that created. I was in my 30s in 1986 and was a news junkie. I didn’t need Wikipedia to remember what happened.
GlobalSecurity.org is the main place I went to gather more details:
http://www.globalsecurity.org/military/ops/el_dorado_canyon.htm
Savage’s “point” was that he believes Ronald Reagan attacked Libya for domestic political reasons that were motivated by low ratings – and he expects that now Barack Obama will do the same with Iran. That says a lot about what he actually thought about Ronald Reagan. Based on his life story, I don’t believe Michael Savage is a Conservative – I think he is a guy on the radio pretending to be a Conservative. He even tells you that on a regular basis.
The attack was in response to a bombing of a Disco in Europe. Its intent was to kill Qaddafi, but he escaped because the planes were spotted on radar on their way to Libya and he was warned with a phone call. His own military was completely unprepared to defend against the attack.
One thing I learned that I didn’t know was that the Pentagon considered using the F117 stealth aircraft for the attack, which at the time will still top secret. Reading between the lines, that probably meant flying over France without permission hoping that the stealth technology would prevent the French from knowing what happened – but they decided not to risk exposing the technology if one crashed or was shot down – and the reaction from France and the damage to NATO of violating France’s sovereignty. The Soviet Union was still alive and well in 1986, which I don’t need to go to Wikipedia to know.
I believe his point was that presidents in general will engage the US in military pursuits when their approval ratings go down. Remember that Clinton bombed the aspirin factory shortly after the Lewinsky scandal broke (“Wag the Dog” strategy.) The myth among leftists in 2004 was that the only reason GW Bush was reelected was that we were involved in Iraq, and voters are unlikely to change administrations in wartime. The speculation (an idea I happen to believe, BTW) is that Øbama will get us involved in the conflict that is brewing between Iran (and every other Islamic state) and Israel so that he will be a shoo-in in 2012.
But Reagan was not unpopular in 1986 and his ratings were going up. Why did Savage pick that as an example? I mentioned it – without pointing to cause and effect – that a few months later, the Democrats would regain control of the U.S. Senate, so if that was his strategy, it didn’t work.
Why not mention Bill Clinton’s attack on Iraq in 1998 (Operation Desert Fox) to destroy its WMD capacity and distract the country from Monica Lewinsky?
He also could have chosen Reagan’s invasion of Grenada (1983), which would have been more accurate to his point – but there are no Arabs involved in the Grenada story. (Yes, I know Iran is Persian, not Arab)
I believe the answer is that Savage is fake. He is a herbal cure salesman who is playing a Conservative character on radio. He was hanging out with Marxists hippies on North Beach in San Francisco at the time, and that’s why he remembers it as “He did it because he was unpopular”. All of his “off the top of my head” culture references are to liberal or Marxists writers and things a liberal would have experienced. It’s what he knows because that’s what he is.
Bonus reading
His only “claim” to be a Conservative (which he repeats frequently) is his belief that affirmative action stopped him from getting a professorship at Berkeley. Even that is bogus, since the Civil Rights Act of 1964 that laid the foundation for Affirmative Action had wide support among Republicans.
Someone should call him up and ask “What are the three most important things you think Ronald Reagan accomplished?”
Or if you want to wander into the inappropriate – ask yourself why a married man and father of two is sleeping by himself in a bed with a dog at his feet and only rarely mentions his wife, his marriage or his children.